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  1. The rice shield's Avatar
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    Jan 5, 2014, 2:49 AM - ROTJ or ESB DH-17 reference pics? #1

    Sorry if this is the wrong section, but I am looking to build a replica ESB or ROTJ DH-17 blaster but am having trouble finding many reference pics any where. The decent pic I can seem to find is of the left side of the blaster but I cant seem to find any others. If someone could help me out that would be great.
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  3. Member Since
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    Jan 5, 2014, 11:17 AM - Re: ROTJ or ESB DH-17 reference pics? #2

    Ok several years ago i started (but havent) finished) building one of these, in my studies i found out that the original 17s were not made frome sterling smgs like the storm trooper blasters, i think i remember them being made by bsa, if you look closely at the places where the grips atach to the recievers you will be able to spot it, also the slot where the bolt slides is different. Then at somepoint they started making the 17s out of castings and they really got dumbed downed. I hope this helps. I do not think i would build mine off of the one billy dee holds, i would build one based on the rebel troopers in anh. Hope this helps
  4. The rice shield's Avatar
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    Jan 5, 2014, 12:14 PM - Re: ROTJ or ESB DH-17 reference pics? #3

    Thanks
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    Jan 5, 2014, 3:07 PM - Re: ROTJ or ESB DH-17 reference pics? #4

    there's one of the ESB DH 17 in the Star Wars VD, held by Lando...right side seen in large format, left side small IIRC
    plus there is the ROTJ's left side shown

    besides of that there are PLENTY of pictures of the ESB and even the ROTJ DH17 from the various exhibitions.
    google for StarWars exhibit, Magic of the Myth etc.

    The ANH and the ESB blasters were based on L2A3's, but at least shortened and modified to a degree...maybe they even redid the receiver tube, based on the repositioned mag well, ejection port shape, missing trunnion etc.!?
    The ROTJ is based on a MGC Sterling, hard to find these days and most of the times more expensive than a genuine Sterling. Got lucky and purchased three about 7-10 years ago.

    Markus
    Last edited by OdiWan72; Jan 6, 2014 at 8:59 AM.
  6. Keeping my lousy nickname RPF Premium Member Darth Lars's Avatar
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    Jan 6, 2014, 8:15 AM - Re: ROTJ or ESB DH-17 reference pics? #5

    Here are the best ones I have of the ESB blaster. I think I have got all of them from other posts on this board, where not all may still be available. (The credits are in the filenames)

    planet-hollywood-orlando-stormtrooper-.jpgdsc_5152.jpgdh17esb_swc3.jpgesb-rebel-blaster-neocybe-.jpgesb-rebel001.jpgesbdh17_scope.jpgesbdh17_lando.jpg

    All blasters in ANH and ESB were resin-casts. No metal blasters. The ANH blasters got various different greeblies and real scopes added to them after casting while the ESB casts are of complete blasters.

    Many parts on the ESB master (which was cast) are indeed from a British Sterling machine gun. Several other greeblies have been identified as being from the model kits Revell Phantom F4E and the Visible V8 Model Engine: two kits that lent parts to several other Star Wars props. Resin casts of these parts should be available from several sources.

    I would suggest that if you build a replica that you not base it on a Hasbro toy, but that you use a tube and resin-casts of real Sterling parts and Singlepoint scope. The Hasbro does not have the correct proportions and you would have to modify a lot to make it look right. Plus, the Hasbro does not have the mag well and magazine. I built one from a Hasbro and had to scratch-build the mag well in a slightly smaller scale to get the proportions closer to being right, and with resin-casts available that is work that you could avoid.
    Last edited by Darth Lars; Jan 6, 2014 at 8:22 AM.
  7. Member Since
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    Jan 6, 2014, 7:02 PM - Re: ROTJ or ESB DH-17 reference pics? #6







    From the site: "The Star Wars Archive Database"

    Rebel Blaster Silicone Mold - Star Wars Collectors Archive


    And this one:



    Go to this site for the larger version:
    http://www.originalprop.com/blog/200...el-exhibition/
    Last edited by Jedifather; Jan 6, 2014 at 7:17 PM.
  8. Sluis Van Shipyards's Avatar
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    Jan 6, 2014, 7:06 PM - Re: ROTJ or ESB DH-17 reference pics? #7

    The ESB blaster bugs the heck out of me because they just slapped a model Sidewinder missile to the side. It just seems lazy. Mod it or something!
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    James Kenobi 1138's Avatar
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    Jan 6, 2014, 9:00 PM - Re: ROTJ or ESB DH-17 reference pics? #8

    Sluis Van Shipyards said: View Post
    The ESB blaster bugs the heck out of me because they just slapped a model Sidewinder missile to the side. It just seems lazy. Mod it or something!
    I feel the same way. It's so recognizable they might have just glued an unpainted #2 yellow pencil on the side instead.
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    James Kenobi 1138's Avatar
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    Jan 6, 2014, 9:06 PM - Re: ROTJ or ESB DH-17 reference pics? #9

    I thought the Hasbro toy was modeled to look like the blaster in the above screen cap, from the Tantive in ANH.

    It doesn't have a side mag, so those are accurate to that specific gun?
  11. Keeping my lousy nickname RPF Premium Member Darth Lars's Avatar
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    Jan 7, 2014, 6:56 AM - Re: ROTJ or ESB DH-17 reference pics? #10

    James Kenobi 1138 said: View Post
    It doesn't have a side mag, so those are accurate to that specific gun?
    The Hasbro is of the ANH version and it has a hole where there is a mag on the ESB version. I think it would be interesting to see how a Sterling with its mag removed looks like - if the hole for the mag well matches what the ANH version has.
    Otherwise, the ESB and ANH versions have the same proportions and the same barrels. The ESB version lacks a D-ring on the endcap, has more detail in the front sight and different greeblies covering the rivets in the rear sight.

    Hasbro's toy is relatively accurate, but is shorter than the prop and some geometry is simplified. The trigger is different because it is a NERF gun.
    It has got greeblies copied from Master Replicas' replica, and those greeblies are believed to be MR's own interpretation from fuzzy screencaps more than anything else.
    Last edited by Darth Lars; Jan 7, 2014 at 7:10 AM.
  12. Mara Jade's Father's Avatar
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    Jan 7, 2014, 9:41 AM - Re: ROTJ or ESB DH-17 reference pics? #11

    I know that there are some casts floating around from the actual ANH mold. Now I have never seen a cast in person but to me the DH-17s in ANH, appear smaller than a Sterling. Almost like the mold was accidentally or purposely allowed to shrink to produce a smaller weapon. I also am open to the idea that this is just a self created illusion.

    Can anyone post a pict of a cast and a real Sterling (or even something like an MR) side by side?
  13. Keeping my lousy nickname RPF Premium Member Darth Lars's Avatar
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    Jan 7, 2014, 10:30 AM - Re: ROTJ or ESB DH-17 reference pics? #12

    The nth generation casts of the ANH blasters that float around are indeed smaller than Sterlings, and also somewhat deformed. Pictures of them have been posted on the board.

    Jesper Isberg has a supposed actual prop in his collection that he has had on display at the conventions that he has organised. I have seen that blaster in person albeit at a distance and don't remember it looking like it was too small.
    The scope cast is a later addition. If I measure in the picture and scale the diameter of the receiver using the known diameter of the scope bell, then the diameter of the blaster is only a mm or so smaller than a Sterling, and I think that is reasonable.

    If the dimensions are 1:1, then the distance between the mag well and the endcap is the same as on a Sterling, but the grip and trigger assembly have been moved back. The total length of a DH-17 is shorter than a E-11, but actually not by that much. The DH-17 has a pointy nozzle while the Sterling's nozzle is snub-nosed which further makes the DH-17 look shorter.
  14. Mara Jade's Father's Avatar
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    Jan 7, 2014, 2:27 PM - Re: ROTJ or ESB DH-17 reference pics? #13

    I'd love an idealized version of the ANH version. I'd like to see someone 3D print the main body with the modified round trigger guard and then add on a machined muzzle/barrel, scope rail, scope rings, and scope.
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    Jan 7, 2014, 4:32 PM - Re: ROTJ or ESB DH-17 reference pics? #14

    Mara Jade's Father said: View Post
    ...... but to me the DH-17s in ANH, appear smaller than a Sterling. Almost like the mold was accidentally or purposely allowed to shrink to produce a smaller weapon. I also am open to the idea that this is just a self created illusion.

    Can anyone post a pict of a cast and a real Sterling (or even something like an MR) side by side?
    I've always thought the same thing. It just doesn't seem as big as a Sterling.
  16. The rice shield's Avatar
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    Jan 8, 2014, 1:00 AM - Re: ROTJ or ESB DH-17 reference pics? #15

    Why do some have the large trigger guards but some are thin like this?
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails ilm_dh17_blaster.jpg  
  17. el loco's Avatar
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    Jan 8, 2014, 1:58 AM - Re: ROTJ or ESB DH-17 reference pics? #16

    Cause the ones with the larger/thicker trigger guards are castings




    The rice shield said: View Post
    Why do some have the large trigger guards but some are thin like this?
    http://studiocreations.com/howto/reb...17_blaster.jpg
  18. Keeping my lousy nickname RPF Premium Member Darth Lars's Avatar
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    Jan 8, 2014, 2:35 AM - Re: ROTJ or ESB DH-17 reference pics? #17

    The ESB blasters with thin trigger guards are castings too. There is resin behind the trigger.
    I dunno why they made some ESB blasters with thick trigger guards and other ESB blasters with thin. My guess is that they used some more brittle type of resin for some, maybe had it diluted with some filler to save costs.
  19. Mara Jade's Father's Avatar
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    Jan 8, 2014, 9:06 AM - Re: ROTJ or ESB DH-17 reference pics? #18

    The rice shield said: View Post
    Why do some have the large trigger guards but some are thin like this?
    http://studiocreations.com/howto/reb...17_blaster.jpg
    To me, that particular one does not look like a casting (I base that on the clean and thin holes in the barrel vents and magazine. Where did that pict come from (originally)? Is it screen used or a fan made replica?
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    Jan 8, 2014, 9:29 AM - Re: ROTJ or ESB DH-17 reference pics? #19

    Mara Jade's Father said: View Post
    To me, that particular one does not look like a casting (I base that on the clean and thin holes in the barrel vents and magazine. Where did that pict come from (originally)? Is it screen used or a fan made replica?
    Thatīs a ROTJ DH17, based on a MGC sterling instead of a real L2A3...quite a few differences!
    This pic can be found in the SW VD.

    And yes, the casts of the screenused ANH DH-17 are significantly smaller, but not on purpose IMHO.
    Itīs just a result of the materials the used for molding/ casting, combined with the "tooth of time" nagging on these mold.

    Markus
  21. Mara Jade's Father's Avatar
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    Jan 8, 2014, 1:37 PM - Re: ROTJ or ESB DH-17 reference pics? #20

    OdiWan72 said: View Post
    Thatīs a ROTJ DH17, based on a MGC sterling instead of a real L2A3...quite a few differences!
    This pic can be found in the SW VD.

    And yes, the casts of the screenused ANH DH-17 are significantly smaller, but not on purpose IMHO.
    Itīs just a result of the materials the used for molding/ casting, combined with the "tooth of time" nagging on these mold.

    Markus
    Well as you know, the Star Wars visual dictionary is filled with many replicas in order to have quality images in the book. So now I guess I am asking, does that image/ or the prop itself exist in the LFL archives? Or is there any other good info about this variant existing in the movie that was not a cast?

    Also, from what I see, the small size of the A New Hope variant is not due to time or recasting as they appear closer to pistol size in the movie as well. I would imagine that those are first generation pulls made shortly after the mold was made. I do not recall another cast item appearing smaller due to casting in the way that the DH-17 appears to be.

    In close, I basically am just looking to be educated in this subject. Mostly I am confused by what I see in regards to this prop.
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    James Kenobi 1138's Avatar
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    Jan 8, 2014, 1:49 PM - Re: ROTJ or ESB DH-17 reference pics? #21

    When the Deathstar Troopers pull these guns out of their holsters in the Detention Block they practically look like long handguns instead of short rifles.
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    Jan 8, 2014, 3:44 PM - Re: ROTJ or ESB DH-17 reference pics? #22

    Mara Jade's Father said: View Post
    Well as you know, the Star Wars visual dictionary is filled with many replicas in order to have quality images in the book. So now I guess I am asking, does that image/ or the prop itself exist in the LFL archives? Or is there any other good info about this variant existing in the movie that was not a cast?

    Also, from what I see, the small size of the A New Hope variant is not due to time or recasting as they appear closer to pistol size in the movie as well. I would imagine that those are first generation pulls made shortly after the mold was made. I do not recall another cast item appearing smaller due to casting in the way that the DH-17 appears to be.

    In close, I basically am just looking to be educated in this subject. Mostly I am confused by what I see in regards to this prop.
    Well...the ROTJ DH17 was/is part of various exhibitions and is pictured along with the ROTJ E-11 in post #6
    So the answer if this prop exists in the archives should be yes. Not sure about its use in ROTJ, never been someone to do screencaps.

    The size difference of the cast ANH DH17 I was referring to is not based on the actual build/ setup of the blaster (shorter rear section w/o trunnion, no mag well, repositioned sight etc., but the shrinkage of the castings compared to real L2A3 components. I would say it is at least 10% smaller (O.D. of receiver, grips, endcap etc.) The mold we see was obviously made from an already -poorly- cast blaster, hence the additional shrinkage.

    Markus
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    Jan 8, 2014, 3:48 PM - Re: ROTJ or ESB DH-17 reference pics? #23

    The MGC based Rebel Blasters were absolutely made for ROTJ, but never appear on screen anywhere.

    The first film rebel blasters have thick trigger guards and no magazines.

    The ESB rebel blasters have thinner trigger guards, have magazines, and have more extensive greeblie detailing.

    Brandon
  25. Keeping my lousy nickname RPF Premium Member Darth Lars's Avatar
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    Jan 8, 2014, 9:58 PM - Re: ROTJ or ESB DH-17 reference pics? #24

    BAlinger15 said: View Post
    The MGC based Rebel Blasters were absolutely made for ROTJ, but never appear on screen anywhere.
    There are lots of extras on Home One in ROTJ, that we never get to see up close. Maybe one of them has the blaster in a holster ...

    BAlinger15 said: View Post
    The ESB rebel blasters have thinner trigger guards ...
    Except for the blaster that Lando is holding in a promo pic, which I posted above.
    Other than that detail, I see no other difference from the Planet Hollywood blaster. Hey, this blaster could have been damaged and the trigger guard thickened in the repair.
    On the other hand, quite a few were cast for the Rebel Soldiers on Hoth, each one of them carrying one as a side-arm, so maybe there was more than one mould. I also think there are at least two variations of the ESB stunt E-11 blaster.
    Last edited by Darth Lars; Jan 8, 2014 at 10:08 PM.
  26. Mara Jade's Father's Avatar
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    Jan 10, 2014, 1:59 PM - Re: ROTJ or ESB DH-17 reference pics? #25

    Jedifather said: View Post
    I've always thought the same thing. It just doesn't seem as big as a Sterling.
    James Kenobi 1138 said: View Post
    When the Deathstar Troopers pull these guns out of their holsters in the Detention Block they practically look like long handguns instead of short rifles.
    IMHO The ANH blasters should be designated as something else. I agree, much more pistol like (size and the way it is wielded and held) than the ESB/ROTJ size utilized as a tactical rifle style.

    If I had any skill and proper tools, I would love to turn my MR DH-17 into a ESB or ROTJ variant because it appears to be a size better suited for it. I know this might be sacrilegious to some of our more prominent blaster enthusiast here, but I quite enjoy the my ANH variant I modified from the Hasbro toy. I know it is smaller than the ANH version but it is closer in size (IMHO) than the Sterling/MGC scale.

    Like I said earlier, I'd love to see someone develop and nice 3D print of the body of the DH-17 ANH variant.
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