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  1. Kroenen77's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Aug 13, 2014, 5:54 PM - Darth Vader ROTJ Reveal mask My build #1

    The scene where Luke Skywalker removes his fathers mask in ROTJ was the greatest experience for me as I was a kid...and that hasnt changed.
    So I was looking for a really accurate ROTJ-Reveal set over the years.But Ive found nothing...the ketzermask was the best...but it is impossible to become one in a good quality today.And the ketzer has not all details in the mold...so you need to upgrade it if want all details of the original.


    To build a Reveal is an own science.The most pics of this prop are made on the SW-expos over the years.There are some very nice shots and detailshots out there..but its hard to say how the mask would look in neutral position.Most times they used thick rubberpieces under the backsides of the mask,complete cloth material under the mask or only put the back of the mask on a platform.
    All this methodes adulterates the overall look of the mask.Same with the lights and the flash...so its impossible to find the 100% right color.




    But there will be some good shots and positions where you can see the right shape...I will show some of them in this thread later.


    I collected over 1000 pics of this prop over the years..some are great others not.But I think Ive seen most important details of this mask .

    So it is on me to build a reveal that looks not like a joke next to the original.I really hope that I can do that.;-)

    First I must say THANKS to my good old american friend James for a lot of help with tips,pics and parts.He is a real Vaderexpert and is an owner of a great copy of a ketzermask.Thanks my friend!




    I bought an old portumac set years ago...he told me that his mask is absolute screenaccurate...a joke.The only points that are useful on his mold are the position of the windows for the dynodes,the size of this crown and that he used an old DP DLX Vaderhelmet as the base of his mask.Every of the other details are wrong!





    And it was a lot of work to make the 2 parts inline..but portumacs closing system for the helmet is wrong..but later more



    and overall not a good quality in my eyes...the windows for the dynodes where not 100% accurate and a lot too thick fiberlass:



    Needs to close all the holes and make the windows correct:




    So what is to do?

    -The complete shape of the crown is wrong.
    -The edge of the crown is wrong
    -The nose is too small and wrong shape
    -bottom edge of the lower jaw is wrong
    -the mask has no rails under the facemask
    -and no slots in the lower jaw for the rails
    -the round sidetubes are not on the sides of the mask
    -the small ramps are not on the lower jawpiece
    -the eyebrows are too pointed
    -and some other little details that you will see later





    Ok...lets start with the new crown...to find out the right size of my disc I used this trick:



    All parts Ive found online from plastruct and others had not the right shape and dimensions..so I used a metaldisc that Ive found in a hardwarestore.
    After cutting the old crown away and sand the rest down to the right height I build it in the mask:



    After that the really hard way...cutting the big and the 2 small holes in the disc...I used 4 diamond dremel discs and became some burned fingers for that...very hot to cut stainless steel!








    The next step is the edge of the disc...its round and not sharp:






    And needs to mold the rest of the crown,too:




    Here next to the original:












    So ok...next step is the nose...that is very tricky to sculpt from hand but I have a ROTJ fiberglasshelmet in my collection to
    show the right dimensions.

    Ok it starts with a lot of green putty to become the rough and bulky shape on the lot too thin nosearea...








    Then starts the sanding and molding...a long process...you need to add very fine material in the spaces because portumacs are
    complete out of shape...



    My nose and grooves next to the originals:





    Last edited by Kroenen77; 2 Weeks Ago at 7:24 PM.
  2. Member Since
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    2 Weeks Ago  Aug 14, 2014, 12:55 AM - Re: Darth Vader ROTJ Reveal mask My build #2

    Wow great work so far, this is going to be an epic build for sure. Love your ingenuity in reforming the dome and willingness to make some major modifications. Subscribed!
  3. RPF Premium Member OdiWan72's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Aug 14, 2014, 2:50 AM - Re: Darth Vader ROTJ Reveal mask My build #3

    WOW....talk about dedication to detail!!!

    Subscribed

    Markus
  4. Kroenen77's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Aug 14, 2014, 11:17 AM - Re: Darth Vader ROTJ Reveal mask My build #4

    Thanks guys....happy that you like it...stay tuned!
  5. RPF Premium Member OdiWan72's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Aug 14, 2014, 12:04 PM - Re: Darth Vader ROTJ Reveal mask My build #5

    do you have all needed parts for the interior/ exterior?

    Markus
  6. Kroenen77's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Aug 14, 2014, 12:23 PM - Re: Darth Vader ROTJ Reveal mask My build #6

    The most of them...but Im not happy with all of them.

    The back and some little details of the facemask I will do later...lets look on the lower jaw piece:
    Portumac created his own railsystem for the facemask but he cutted the sidetubes in the half.So the upper mask can be fixed between this half tubes.



    That is ok..but complete wrong.The original has a "grooves/rails"system and on the front are "ramps" that are looking a little bit over the sidetubes.





    The rails under the mask:




    The sidetubes are complete round with a thin piece of metal or something between the mask and the tubes.
    This details are the hardest parts of the complete build,because facemask,sidetubes and the little tubes on the front must fit perfect together.







    First step is to cut the wrong tubes away:



    After that I cutted the spaces under the mask and molded the ramps on the lower jaw:




    The next step are the grooves in the lower jaw and the rails under the facemask.

    I used stripes ABS-Plastic and putty for that:





    The new tubes...:

    Last edited by Kroenen77; 2 Weeks Ago at 1:42 PM.
  7. Sym-Cha's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Aug 14, 2014, 4:02 PM - Re: Darth Vader ROTJ Reveal mask My build #7

    Wow ... exactly what I need to start working on my own DV ROTJ Reveal ... especially with these excellent pictures to accompany the work in progress

    When getting to start on adding all the internal parts and pieces ... could you perhaps provide the origin and where to look for the genuine part/piece?

    Chaim
  8. Kroenen77's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Aug 14, 2014, 4:51 PM - Re: Darth Vader ROTJ Reveal mask My build #8

    Hope you can build a great mask,Chaim!
    What do you wanna know?









    So...and here the finished tubes and next to the originalpart:

    Last edited by Kroenen77; 2 Weeks Ago at 6:32 PM.
  9. Sym-Cha's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Aug 14, 2014, 4:59 PM - Re: Darth Vader ROTJ Reveal mask My build #9

    Yeah ... me too ... I got some parts but need to clean up the inside mess first, since the previous owner took out all he could re-use anyways since most threads online on several forums have been a thing of the past ... and most pictures have been removed ... I'd like an as complete list as possible of all the parts needed to finish this to perfection as the original helmet was. So what those parts originally were used for or in and where to track them down . . . before I need to rely on replica parts still being a work in progress by some members here.

    Meanwhile here's my helmet and yes it came with a dome :



    and some of the parts which were left over :



    and I have my very own Portumac neckbrace to go with all this :


    (All Pictures courtesy Reel Fakes)

    However first I really need to fix the fact that both head and neck parts of the facemask don't close properly

    Chaim
    Last edited by Sym-Cha; 2 Weeks Ago at 5:42 PM.
  10. Kroenen77's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Aug 14, 2014, 5:49 PM - Re: Darth Vader ROTJ Reveal mask My build #10

    Your helmet looks good.I like the grey color on the helmet,too.
    About the parts:Oh,the most parts are a secret forever I would say.Nobody knows what the propmaker used for all the little parts.Only the Dynodes,the Dentalexpanders and some other small parts are famous..but the rest is a big mystery.
  11. Cast From Original RPF Premium Member sskunky's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Aug 14, 2014, 6:04 PM - Re: Darth Vader ROTJ Reveal mask My build #11

    This is great! I'm still chasing people up on stuff I had drawn so it can be 3D CAD..... I have had some of them done but the rest are with the guy who drew them up and he's not been very forthcoming on getting them to me..... I've been asking for a couple of years! Looks like I will have to start again on the missing parts as I just keep getting the run around.... Shame...

    Anyway... subscribed and watching.
  12. Sym-Cha's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Aug 14, 2014, 6:12 PM - Re: Darth Vader ROTJ Reveal mask My build #12

    Hi sskunky ...

    I was hoping you would join us ... perhaps a new 'kid' on the block could assist you with your files, he's an industrial designer and has many contacts ... I'll ask him when we meet next month, okay?

    Indeed I like the grey color too ... so I'll try to avoid having to do a complete paintover ... although the 'pianokeys' you see now on top, wil have to be replaced with the more accurate ones in my stash

    Chaim
    Last edited by Sym-Cha; 2 Weeks Ago at 6:21 PM.
  13. Kroenen77's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Aug 14, 2014, 6:17 PM - Re: Darth Vader ROTJ Reveal mask My build #13

    Thanks,Mark...are you talking about the linkages,too?I think I must cut them all myself from ABS-Plastic.The linkages from portumac are not accurate in dimensions.
    The pianokeys on the crown I made from pics of the originalprop and a friend made my masters from metal for me.I would be happy to have the linkages with the markings "LTRS" and "1-4" with the accurate letters.

  14. RPF Premium Member NeoRutty's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Aug 14, 2014, 6:28 PM - Re: Darth Vader ROTJ Reveal mask My build #14

    This looks great!... I'm instantly interested in looking into what it takes to put together a good Vader reveal, but I think I'll wait off a few years before jumping down THAT rabbit hole...
  15. Cast From Original RPF Premium Member sskunky's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Aug 15, 2014, 3:50 AM - Re: Darth Vader ROTJ Reveal mask My build #15

    Hi guys

    I am talking about nearly all the parts...... I have had most drawn up including linkages, grinder, inner face parts, bars, spikes, wheels, etc, etc, I have had some parts converted to 3D cad but there are some drawings I am missing. Or not able to get hold of as the guy drawing them is holding back on me.........
  16. Sym-Cha's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Aug 15, 2014, 4:57 PM - Re: Darth Vader ROTJ Reveal mask My build #16

    With this almost extinct forum : http://darthvaderrevealed.yuku.com/t...t#.U-gHxUhoV7w one would think there should be at least dozens of DV ROTJ Reveal helmets out there on the internet and everything was already documented ... alas lots of the pictures are gone ... so with this new interest for this subject ... perhaps we could start a final and definitive thread ... once and for all ... with the addition of newly replicated or found parts to become available in it's wake?

    So beginning with, eventhough I have some silver and copper dynodes already, . . . can anyone enlighten me which exact type EMI PHOTOMULTIPLIER TUBE contains the screen-accurate dynodes = copper version with round background?

    Chaim
    Last edited by Sym-Cha; 2 Weeks Ago at 5:02 PM.
  17. Kroenen77's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Aug 15, 2014, 5:34 PM - Re: Darth Vader ROTJ Reveal mask My build #17

    If you want it really accurate you must build the most parts from scratch.From what I know is,that nobody made the linkages 100% accurate or printed the accurate markings in them.Another problem is,that not every sculpt is the same...some crowns are more flat,some higher,the windows for the dynodes are cutted with different distances on the mask...all that is very important for the overall look of the prop.Ok,if you only want a DV Reveal that is not so accurate...no problem...but if you want one that you can put next to a originalpic...that is a complete other story.The problem is that nobody knows what the linkages are...a myth is that they are from an old german typewriter...but I contacted a lot of typewriterexpert and bought old typewriters from ebay over the years...no answer.This prop is a big secret...and that still over 30 Years after the movie!
  18. Sym-Cha's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Aug 15, 2014, 8:19 PM - Re: Darth Vader ROTJ Reveal mask My build #18

    Thanks ... yes I realized all that ... it's just that I don't have a list of all the parts needed and true I'm not all that hung up on screen-accurate just as close as I can get would be nice ... when I have some extra time I'll post pics of all my parts which I have gathered sofar or came with the mask and dome

    Chaim
  19. Cast From Original RPF Premium Member sskunky's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Aug 16, 2014, 3:07 AM - Re: Darth Vader ROTJ Reveal mask My build #19

    I have an almost complete kit. Some of it found, most of it made. I have linkages with 1-4 on them.
    I started collecting parts originally on the Vadrr Reveal Yahoo group many moons ago. Must be nearly 10 years ago! I have since replaced many of those parts.
    Vader Doctor on eBay made some amazing parts out of Alu.
    Hopefully I can get this kit off the ground. Let's do it. I'll get a list and pics together of the parts I do have drawn up and see what we can do with the rest.
  20. Kroenen77's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Aug 16, 2014, 4:19 AM - Re: Darth Vader ROTJ Reveal mask My build #20

    Yes Vader Doctor made great parts.Its a shame that he is out of the business.
    But from what Ive seen he made the markings wrong on the linkages..wrong lettertypes and too big.The letters are very fine and with a special type of script.

  21. Kroenen77's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Aug 16, 2014, 4:37 AM - Re: Darth Vader ROTJ Reveal mask My build #21

    Sym-Cha said: View Post
    Thanks ... yes I realized all that ... it's just that I don't have a list of all the parts needed and true I'm not all that hung up on screen-accurate just as close as I can get would be nice ... when I have some extra time I'll post pics of all my parts which I have gathered sofar or came with the mask and dome

    Chaim
    Oh that is not a big problem...if you dont want it very accurate you can buy the most parts from portumac(if he is still in the business now).But be warned...some of his "metallparts" are no real metal.When you wanna bend it to fix it in the mask you need hot air or it breaks.He said that he will send me a replacement for the broken part...but he never did.



    Oh and could you find out what the gunmetal color is on your mask(Duplicolorcode?)?I would give it a try...looks very good on your pics.
    Last edited by Kroenen77; 2 Weeks Ago at 4:47 AM.
  22. Sym-Cha's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Aug 16, 2014, 7:45 AM - Re: Darth Vader ROTJ Reveal mask My build #22

    It's Tamiya Gunmetal (TS-38) I already asked Reel Fakes, in case I needed to restore or repaint the facemask

    As for the much needed parts I'll put my money on sskunky's stuff, thank you very much, since he's in the UK
    which will avoid having to pay for additional custom tax on some more expensive parts

    Oh and ... I'll take that broken part if you have no use for it further ... I only need one, eventhough originally
    the neckpart had 2 I suppose

    Chaim
  23. Kroenen77's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Aug 16, 2014, 8:41 AM - Re: Darth Vader ROTJ Reveal mask My build #23

    Ah,thanks for the info.I have T-38 here...did he sprayed it on black or direct on the primer?

    About the parts...the reveal had 2 of the parts in the movie.You can see it here:

  24. Sym-Cha's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Aug 16, 2014, 9:52 AM - Re: Darth Vader ROTJ Reveal mask My build #24

    Ah ... okay ... 2 it shall be then when the time comes

    He sprayed it directly onto a white primer ... as far as I can
    tell from some of the paint damages from inside the neck.

    Chaim
  25. Kroenen77's Avatar
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    2 Weeks Ago  Aug 16, 2014, 4:23 PM - Re: Darth Vader ROTJ Reveal mask My build #25

    Haha...ok!
    Hm...the TS-38 is very dark and not so fine...but on your pic it looks great.I sprayed it on a testobject...but a flat one.

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