Is Iron Man cursed?

It could just be what I am noticing, but lately, it seems that if a deal has gone sour, Iron Man buckets are involved. From Le to that Stark character. I think it is a case of these guys being WOEFULLY out of their depth as mold makers and NOT knowing what they are doing. They then offer up a run of their stuff and get inundated with requests. This then leads to crappy communication as they cower in the corners of mom's basement, weeping and inhaling resin fumes.

I am not the crafter some people are, but I will offer up some old guard advice to both crafter and purchaser.

To the Crafter: If you do not know what you are doing, ask for help and tips. Just because you can "pep" an Iron Man helmet together does not mean you know jack squat about casting, casting cleanly, molding, pulling from said molds, gelcoat cure times and all the other stuff I know jack squat about. You've bought paper, scissors, glue and resin. Not skills.

If you do have skills, then stop selling vaporware. If you don't have it on hand, don't try funding that run with your vaporware sales, especially you newbies. This leads me to buyers.

To the Buyer:

In the immortal words of Wakal(I believe it was him) STOP BUYING VAPORWARE!

There are very few people I will buy vaporware from here, but those people have a long established history. They come through. Rylo, Roman, Russ, Kurt(Chewbaccadoll)...these are the good guys. These guys have mad skills and ALWAYS follow through and communicate with their buyers. The guys who have been crap, well, they gave off the crap vibe from the word go. Caveat Emptor.

Don't take my rant as slamming you guys for poor choices. Hell, we have all made poor choices. The fact of the matter is every new crafter should be met with trepidation. Be cautious. Everyone gets to be trusted once.

Another thing, if communication has dried up before 45 days of the PayPal clock have expired, you had best be escalating your PP claim. To avoid it and sit on your hands is just stupid. Why you guys do not take the matter to the law is another thing that bothers me. This is fraud, and in the case of SOME sellers, potential mail fraud.

I know if you have hundreds of my dollars and try to run, I am coming to your house, with the Police.

That's it...rant over.

That's not a rant.

That is VERY sound advice!

But just an FYI... People will still buy stuff that doesn't exist, from people who have no established product OR any other show of skill or craftsmanship. And they (the buyer) will STILL complain about it.

Couldn't agree more, as someone who has had dealings with less reputable sellers, as well as dealings with reputable ones.

i agree. at the same time, if i were a buyer when concerned with le, his attitude problem everywhere should have been a major red flag to all these people he's screwed over. i feel sorry for them they're out that money, but its really not like they didnt see it coming.

That is kind of what I said. His attitude has been crap since he came here, before he came here and is crap now that he is gone. It is usually that way with people who go belly up like this.

If i buy anything thats fibreglass or cast resin from anyone i've never purchased from before i pretty much buy it as a gamble as to how much work or cleanup it'll need, sort of hope for the best but be prepared for the worst situation.
Having said that i will extremely rarely be in that situation because i usually buy from people i've had first hand experience of their work or i know they have a solid reputation over a prolonged period of time.
And if they use a finished piece as a showoff and they're selling kits ask for pics of a raw kit, a coat of paint can hide a thousand sins.

It's not perfect but it sure does limit the possibility to a minimum of being ripped off completely or being sold a lemon.
I've never once had anyone fail to deliver, though i have had some really crappy pieces turn up in the post before now but that hasn't happened in years since i stopped buying stuff off eBay.

Edit: I tell a lie i have had a non delivery once in 2004 i think, it was a pair of AS handwheels the modern type i bought off eBay from a bathroom supply company, i got a refund for those though.

i just want to clarify, that because of le's attitude problem people shouldnt have been so eager to throw their money at him, because for him to screw them over, they should have been able to see it coming.

I've gotten six different Iron Man helmets from three different makers and never had any trouble at all. Then again, I have been around long enough to recognize the tell-tale signs before it's too late.

The problems with Iron Man deals remind me of the types of things that happen too often in the Batman community. I have some theories about why there are more of these issues among superhero fans than in Star Wars fandom, mostly having to do with the fact that SW fans tend to be older and everybody already knows everybody. Similarly, you almost never hear about these kinds of problems among Universal Monster collectors because "Monster Kids" are generally even older and more established. That (along with the high value of the items involved) is one reason the counterfeit movie poster thing last year was such a big deal for monster collectors.

Just my 2 cents

-Mike

Personally i'd ask you guys who you think is worth dealing with if i'm dropping that kinda cash on something. When in doubt ask before you leap.

I knew it was cursed, I asked if anyone noticed that all the Iron Man helmets have gone sour for the most part, they called me crazy, they laughed and called me a fool, but I was right, lol

But in seriousness, it is a shame as I don't think I could trust buying anything Iron Man related (right now) From anyone besides a few select people, 3 to be precise.

I wouldnt say its cursed. Its popular so the risk goes waaaay up

.:MirrorminD:. said:

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I wouldnt say its cursed. Its popular so the risk goes waaaay up

Actually, that's probably a big part of it. Whatever's most popular is bound to draw the less scrupulous producers.

I don't know how many of you follow the Sideshow Collectibles Iron Man scene, but there definitely seems to be a curse there. Not as bad as some of the ridiculousness that's been going on here, but it's pretty bad for a licensed company.

There seems to be a whisper of "I hope I get a piece with a good paintjob" among the SS IM collectors, as almost every one of their Iron Man statues or busts seem to have issues with the paintjobs (not the sculpts, mind you - There usually aren't any complaints there). Some of the paintjobs are good, while others are horrible with lots of chips or drip. There was some outcry when people were sending back the 1:1 movie busts due to the bad paint, and SS then released a "battle damaged" version of the bust, which was clearly a repaint of the original, pristine bust returns.

Solo4114 said:

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Actually, that's probably a big part of it. Whatever's most popular is bound to draw the less scrupulous producers.

It also draws the less intelligent buyers. Not meant as a slight, but people see a cool item and they forget the 60-6-6 rule of "Good looking" as well.

Qui-Gonzalez said:

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It could just be what I am noticing, but lately, it seems that if a deal has gone sour, Iron Man buckets are involved.

It's funny I remember a thing of deals gone sour involving Wolverine stuff back in 2006 and Predator stuff before then. I'm sure there were people who thought those characters were cursed back then too.

As already said it boils down to artists who have terrific talent, but very little business sense and become overwhelmed with orders. They also suffer from the temptation to spend the money given to them for an item before delivering that item to the buyer (which of course means they can't provide a refund if something goes horribly wrong).


Kevin

Qui-Gonzalez said:

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It also draws the less intelligent buyers. Not meant as a slight, but people see a cool item and they forget the 60-6-6 rule of "Good looking" as well.

Maybe not necessarily "less intelligent" as much as "less experienced." That said, I know even I can fall victim to the "Soooo shiny....do want..." curse from time to time. I've managed to restrain myself most of the time, though.

SSgt Burton said:

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It's funny I remember a thing of deals gone sour involving Wolverine stuff back in 2006 and Predator stuff before then. I'm sure there were people who thought those characters were cursed back then too.

As already said it boils down to artists who have terrific talent, but very little business sense and become overwhelmed with orders. They also suffer from the temptation to spend the money given to them for an item before delivering that item to the buyer (which of course means they can't provide a refund if something goes horribly wrong).


Kevin

Yeah, it's the classic story. This is why in real business they have this thing called investment/startup capital. You know, the money you START with to make your products, which you THEN sell to buyers.

It's always the story that guys end up with a great prototype, then get the "interested" buyers to send them money, which goes into the product (or other stuff) , but it isn't enough and then you get the death spiral of looking for new "interested buyers" to provide incoming cash so you can build the LAST batch of interested buyers' THEIR stuff (or just give refunds), etc., etc.

Somewhere down the line, someone's gotta eat the cost, and somehow it ends up (with the worst of the prop makers, that is) NOT being the prop maker themselves. In other cases, they do give refunds and eat the cost, but the most egregious ones just "pass the buck" it seems.

As someone new to the forum, I have to admit that I have lost a significant sum (still at the moment trying to recoup) to bad sellers/scammers. I may be new to the forum but have been on forums for the last 9 years of my life (I'm 24) and in the past few months that I have been in the "prop scene," I've been worked around more then I have my entire life. I've dealt with motorcycles, model kits in all forms, trucks/cars, etc. online and can honestly say this hobby takes the most caution.

I had imagined that I would need to be more cautious with something like a $14k side car project but it seems that this world is something I need to watch my step in. Luckily I've met a number of great people in the past few months as well from this forum, but sadly, every single one of them has warned me that the prop scene will be a place where I must tip toe in if I do not want to throw money away from bad transactions. Call it my naivete, but I honestly just thought guys who argued about helmet designs and lightsabers were going to be a bit more trustful then some teenage punk selling me a bike with a blown engine.

It's a stepping stone for me though and sadly I'd advise any of the newer members here to always think "buyer beware."

You want cursed, look up the Laura Croft clock projects.

micdavis said:

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You want cursed, look up the Laura Croft clock projects.

I may have been but a lurker back in those days, but *shudder.*

I still have that particular prop on my list of things to do, but I doubt I'll be starting a thread on it...at least until it's a sure thing. I just don't want to drag up the memories of *some* people unless I have something to counteract those memories with.

-Nick