Helmet cooling options.

Goodwolf · May 11, 2013

Rather than dredge up old necrothreads, I figured I'd just start fresh.

So I recently joined the 501st (sandtrooper) and have done a few troops. Since the weather has been cooler than normal, it hasn't been much of a problem, but the other night was pretty warm and I ran into a problem with heat build up in my bucket. Normally, I can deal with heat since I work outside, but the lenses fogging up are definitely going to be an issue. Especially since I'm planning on marching at SWW this weekend. Even though it's a short march in daylight, lenses fogging up can present a problem.

I've been researching a few different ways for cooling, the most popular seem to be fans. One of my squadmates recommended a dual blower setup by a 501st member named Evilboy (I think he's a member here as well) but I never did get a chance to hear how loud the fans were. Too loud and I won't be able to hear what's going on around me.

There was also another member at TDH named Shadowarf who offered a rechargeable setup that looked pretty good, but again, not sure how loud it would be.

Does anybody have any experience with the two setups mentioned above? Or suggestions for a better one if they've had bad experiences with either one?

Balgosa · May 12, 2013

If you don't mind doing the work yourself (which is just soddering 4 wires) you can build Evilboys two fan setup for $16 total.
The 9V battery packs run $3.95 each and the 50mm Squirrel fans are $3.75 each

9V Battery Holders
9V battery holder with switch & 5.5mm/2.1mm plug ID: 67 - $3.95 : Adafruit Industries, Unique & fun DIY electronics and kits

Squirrel Fans
12VDC 50MM BLOWER | AllElectronics.com

here are my quick and dirty versions. Used electrical tape to cover them (which works fine)

Mockle · May 12, 2013

17X17X8mm there really small I have 2 Ill be building into my helmet you can fit them any where,,5V

IMIM2 · May 12, 2013

How long a 9V battery will last, running a fan like this non stop (just approx).
Will this really help to cool down?
Are these turned on only when needed, or just running non stop?
Thank you.

Balgosa · May 12, 2013

IMIM2 said:
How long a 9V battery will last, running a fan like this non stop (just approx).
Will this really help to cool down?
Are these turned on only when needed, or just running non stop?
Thank you.

with the squirrel fans, a 9V runs about 3 hours, sometimes longer depending on the brand. I switch off the switches when i take the helmet off usually to save battery. It really does make a difference in cooling you off, specially if there's no circulation in your helmet.

Mockle, those fans work good too I just prefer the squirrels because they don't face outward so they circulate a little better for me.

IMIM2 · May 12, 2013

Thanks for quick reply.

Now I remember I had one fan on my JT googles for paintball.
It really helped me clear my fogged glasses (because it was very confined).
However the fan is a bit noisy, it can give away my position.
Noises for cosplay is more forgiving.

I wore my iron man helmet with glasses on, and I had no problem with fogged glass,
but I really had a hard time having the sweat running down to my eyes. I had to wear my balaclava.
I saw this kind of fan during my search, so I might wanna try it on.
3 hours non-stop is not bad at all. My led arc last about the same time.
Just don't like having a helmet with cables running down to hips for battery and switch.
I really had to carry a lot of 9V batteries now, including spares :lol

Goodwolf · May 12, 2013

Balgosa said:
If you don't mind doing the work yourself (which is just soddering 4 wires) you can build Evilboys two fan setup for $16 total.
The 9V battery packs run $3.95 each and the 50mm Squirrel fans are $3.75 each

9V Battery Holders
9V battery holder with switch & 5.5mm/2.1mm plug ID: 67 - $3.95 : Adafruit Industries, Unique & fun DIY electronics and kits

Squirrel Fans
12VDC 50MM BLOWER | AllElectronics.com

here are my quick and dirty versions. Used electrical tape to cover them (which works fine)
http://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/544231_449482058469281_2095527079_n.jpg

I'm actually looking into doing something similar if I go the self build route, except for having all the batteries in one place. It's my understaning that running a 12v fan on a 9v battery can damage the blower motors over time, so I went to the local radio shack and bought an 8 cell AA holder. No fancy toggle switch, but there is a 9v style terminal on top that you could use as a breaker by just removing the other side.

Those fans are the ones I really want to get. How loud are they?

Murdoch · May 12, 2013

Hey man try checking motorcycle shops. They have that sort of thing for helmet cooling and heating i think. Good luck in your search...GM

MarkKing · May 12, 2013

Instead of using blowers, would you not user actual fans?
I know they're a little less on power, but they're cheaper & from what I've used in the UK, easier to get hold of!

You could mount on in the mouth vent on the Sand Trooper, blowing fresh air in.
You could mount a second one around the rear, where the indent section is, is it the right side on these? And maybe add an interchangeable piece for warm/cold weather use?
I know it's taking away the 'full originality' of the helmet, but surely comfort is key in most cases.

Balgosa · May 12, 2013

the blower fans are fairly quiet. You can't hear them outside the helmet at least. I have them mounted overtop the mouth holes so they blow air in and to the side. Having it blow directly on my face makes my eyes water I found lol

Goodwolf · May 12, 2013

That sounds good. I just want to be able to hear if someone asks me a question. I may look into something to vary the speed.

Goodwolf · May 12, 2013

So, I've been giving this some thought while at work. My ideal system would have a battery brick to hold 8 AAs, for a total of 12 volts. It would then go into a switch that the only way I can explain it would be like the volume knob on a walkie talkie. So you can vary the speed of the fans and turn them off as needed. So you'd go from the power, to the knob, to the two fans.

Can anybody translate that into something an electrician would understand so I could google up the proper way to put it together?

Goodwolf · May 12, 2013

MarkKing said:
Instead of using blowers, would you not user actual fans?
I know they're a little less on power, but they're cheaper & from what I've used in the UK, easier to get hold of!

You could mount on in the mouth vent on the Sand Trooper, blowing fresh air in.
You could mount a second one around the rear, where the indent section is, is it the right side on these? And maybe add an interchangeable piece for warm/cold weather use?
I know it's taking away the 'full originality' of the helmet, but surely comfort is key in most cases.

One of the issues I've heard people say is that the fans can get any facial hair tangled up in them and even nip your nose if you're not careful. Also, the blowers won't blow on you directly. For some people, that's a plus as they can keep the airflow on the lenses. That's what I'm looking for, really, is a better way to keep the lenses clear. The last troop I did, I was in twilight conditions in a sandy (dark lenses) and the left lens was completely fogged over.

Dynofiend · May 12, 2013

If it's just lens fogging, rather than heat that's the issue, you can try anti-fog treatments. Hockey players sometimes use a dab of shampoo rubbed over the lens to keep their eye shields fog free. I have also heard that Rain-x can work.

IMIM2 · May 12, 2013

the blower picture is actually a fan, I don't see any difference, except maybe there's a duct there (?)
Pics shown by mockle is definitely a fan.
A fan or blower is a simple electrical motor connected to fan blade. Running it at 9V should not be a problem except is goes for slower speed.
Hence adjusting the speed of the fan is actually adjusting the voltage.
Just add a 1k trimpot in series, for adjustable speed.
the walkie-talkie know is actually potentiometer with on/off swich.
A trimpot is actually a mini potentio.

This fan is actually runs quietly. The one that I mentioned earlier for my goggles is very small blade and runs at a very high speed.
It can suck or blow air.

Now instead of blowing air, is it better to suck the heat out of the helmet? The fan should be positioned near the top of the helmet.
If using two, than one on the top to suck the heat and one near chin to blow fresh air in.

Goodwolf · May 12, 2013

IMIM2 said:
the blower picture is actually a fan, I don't see any difference, except maybe there's a duct there (?)

What I'm calling a blower, some people call a "squirrel cage fan" because instead of a propeller looking setup, the moving part looks like... well sort of like a hamster wheel, and yeah, there is a duct to direct the airflow.

Just add a 1k trimpot in series, for adjustable speed.
the walkie-talkie know is actually potentiometer with on/off swich.
A trimpot is actually a mini potentio.

So I'm looking for a potentiometer, basically. Thanks for that. I'm a zookeeper, I don't speak electrician very well.

- - - Updated - - -

Dynofiend said:
If it's just lens fogging, rather than heat that's the issue, you can try anti-fog treatments. Hockey players sometimes use a dab of shampoo rubbed over the lens to keep their eye shields fog free. I have also heard that Rain-x can work.

I wish I could find my anti fog stuff from when I used to dive, but I lost it in one of the moves. Guess I'll have to get some more to help keep it to a minimum. But I'm thinking a fan will add that extra layer of insurance as well.

*Then* I get to start on voice changers after I get that sorted...

MarkKing · May 13, 2013

I know I sai in the mouth vent on the helmet, but I meant elsewhere when I said it.
It's not the mouth part though, it's the bit below that follows the nose shape? Of that makes sense?
Use that for fresh air input & a vent at the back for exhaust?

Rinzler · May 13, 2013

Check out the helmets orthopedic surgeons use under their surgical hoods, the are meant to be quiet enough so the surgeon can hear and keep them cool while they operate on patient (I've got 2 old Stryker helmets I am thinking of converting for cosplay just haven't been inspired yet)

boshuda · May 13, 2013

Goodwolf said:
What I'm calling a blower, some people call a "squirrel cage fan" because instead of a propeller looking setup, the moving part looks like... well sort of like a hamster wheel, and yeah, there is a duct to direct the airflow.

So I'm looking for a potentiometer, basically. Thanks for that. I'm a zookeeper, I don't speak electrician very well.

- - - Updated - - -

I wish I could find my anti fog stuff from when I used to dive, but I lost it in one of the moves. Guess I'll have to get some more to help keep it to a minimum. But I'm thinking a fan will add that extra layer of insurance as well.

*Then* I get to start on voice changers after I get that sorted...

While a potentiometer will work, you might want to look into Pulse Width Modulation. Pots work by lowering the voltage but that gets turned into heat (wasted energy). They're easy to get and use. Pulse Width Modulation actually shuts the fans on and off super fast. PWM gives the advantage of improved battery life at a cost of complexity.

Goodwolf · May 13, 2013

boshuda said:
While a potentiometer will work, you might want to look into Pulse Width Modulation. Pots work by lowering the voltage but that gets turned into heat (wasted energy). They're easy to get and use. Pulse Width Modulation actually shuts the fans on and off super fast. PWM gives the advantage of improved battery life at a cost of complexity.

It's an interesting concept, but the one controller I've seen is too large for my purposes. I want everything to be self contained in the helmet. I'll have to look around and see if there are any smaller controllers available.

Thanks for the tip! :thumbsup

Helmet cooling options.

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