Concept Models

PHArchivist

This is going to get **** thrown at me.

But...

I DON'T GET IT!

For me anyway, the concept models are just that - concepts; prototypes; (and from the truly pessimistic point of view) half-baked, unrealized (fully) ideas.

And compared to the final filming versions, the concepts look silly.

This is just my opinion though. And I:
1.) Respect that everyone has a different opinion
2.) Respect everyone else's right to their own opinion.

But I can't help to wonder if the recent fascination with the concept models is truly a product of the fact that this community is running out of things to do...

Its the chase we love, really. And for SW, all the really cool **** has already been done, sourced, built, painted, etcetera.

So rather than sit back, say, "OK we're done...", why not turn to concept models so we can continue to indulge.

Am I close to home, or way off base?

moffeaton

A little from column A and a little from column B.

For me, I like the challenge. But in the case of the T-16, it WAS the final model... so when I kit it, it's the best of both worlds, eh?

Knightjar

Concepts probably only look silly because you're used to the final version. Many of them are just as valid as designs. Any one of them could have ended up being just as familiar. I think it's interesting to give some of those designs a chance to exist in three dimensions.

PHArchivist

Cool, Jason!

Thanks, by the way for being open-minded.

I know you do like the concepts, and this thread (even though my OP shows some emotion) is not meant to ruffle feathers or find fault with one perspective, by any means.

I mean it genuinely when I say I respect other's opinions.

Good points... And another thing that throws my is they are either unpainted or unweathered (or both) which clearly contributes the the big difference between the concepts and the finals. To your point, and unaltered concept model design, fully painted and weathered, may fit right in.

In FACT...

Wouldn't it be intriguing to see the Cantwell X painted and weathered like a production model?

ringa

I think it's a few things; I think you may be right in your assessment that there are fewer and fewer things to replicate. However, I think it's also that we continually find a way of keeping Star Wars fresh and alive in our hearts and minds.

To many of us older fans, we were just kids when Star Wars was first released. It has become more than a movie, but a link to simpler times and fond memories when movies really could transport us into the fantasy world they portray.

We asked Lorne Peterson after the film was released, when did they (ILM) begin to realize that this film was becoming something extra special. He said that wherever he would go in public he could here people talking. "Star Wars" kept coming up in the multitude of conversations, as he puts it, "blah blah blah blah Star Wars blah blah blah Star Wars blah blah blah Star Wars..."

Well, the talk hasn't stopped after more than 30 years. I think we just want to hold on to the magic.

[Wow! I should be a writer!]

Guy Cowen

Sounds like you just did a 360 degree turn on the idea , You have to admit Rob to have a concept DS next to your Actual DS would be a great display piece?

And a great way of documenting movie History at the same time.

Another reason for some of the concept stuff is they maybe easier subjects to tackle for some folks as opposed to say a SD or DS. I love the concept designs of the OT and a lot ended up in the PT so they are kinda important in a weird round about way.

PHArchivist

I sort of do... I have the off-the-shelf kit, completed, just an arm's length from the big one.

But yeah - 360 - trying to open, and gain different perspectives...

I must say, though (and again - just my opinion) one thing that fascinates me about the big one is how smooth the surface is, yet still conveys SO much detail.

All the warts and bumps on the smaller concept make me uneasy!

ralphee

I think some of the concept models are very elegant. The X wing, and TIE, both are much more dainty than the finished on screen prop.

Some are downright awful though, i mean, just look at the Sandcrawler, or Landspeeder?

The latter, i just wouldnt want to see done, but the X, Tie, and even the Y wing, yeah, very interesting models, more so, in the case of the Y wing, you can see the embryonic stages of donors parts really being utilised, it even shares some of the same donors, so that i find interesting.

I think they are a Marmite kid of deal though, love or hate, but theres no denying, they are all a spendy chase in kit parts, and thats always part of that thrill, the hunt to recreate something, built wayyyy before A New Hope was on the cutting floor.

lee

joewhite

I was thinking the same thing. I've never intended to build the prototypes but after reading the movie threads that have pics of the Cantwell turnarounds in full detail, it's easy to lose yourself in the thought of hunting down all those parts.

I personally have always liked the Sandcrawler and X-Wing.

Joe

Clutch

Run out of stuff to build...

moffeaton

I can only speak for myself, but I will NEVER run out of stuff to build!

My plate looks like this right now... so there's no way I'm running out of stuff to build before I "turn to concept vehicles" out of desperation. I'll turn to them when the whim strikes!

Studio Scale TIE (for client) - temp on hold while I sort the too-long armature and too-short wing star problems out... maybe going to wait for the Efx model to compare values against?

Studio Scale Colonial Movers - lights, vipers, full monty for a client. Waiting on the decal guy for the Viper markings.

Maschinen Krieger lunar base - a 3 foot by 6 foot diorama in 1/20th scale for a client - it's more than halfway finished.

Blade Runner Blimp - waiting on the laser cutter guy to get the armature to begin building. Working on photo etch in the computer, and gondolas in meat space.

1/12th Lola race car converted to "Mad Max" specs, for giggles. Working here and there on the interior as time allows.

1/35th pattern for salt flat racer kit for a friend. No pressure except my own to get it done.

Studio Scale ESB AT-ST - would like to have my personal build done by the Spring

Studio Scale Slave 1 - should be receiving vac-formed body shells shortly!!

Pattern for kitting a Studio Scale T-16 Skyhopper - we're still IDing stuff - closer to being done than not!

franz bolo

Are you talking about these type of models?




I think they are great! It's the inspiration that eventually became the final model.
I like seeing pencil and marker concept art more than full, beautiful pristine renders so I always am interested in the more obscure concepts.

The only model kit I've bought was the Correllian Corvette. All the final kits aren't really that interesting.

FB

REL

Concepts are pure art, it's usually an initial design that comes straight from the imagination, before the design is changed for reasons of practicality. That's why they appeal to me anyway.

CB2001

When it comes to filmmaking (as I assume is also true with every other field such as buildings, cars, toys and whatnot), the head honcho likes to have options. For film, the director talks with the production designer and looks at various conceptions and designs to see what things work and what things don't. And often, they end up changing several things that end up becoming iconic.

For example, Back to the Future. Originally, the time machine began as a fridge, then became a giant tank and the eventually became the DeLorean that has now become iconic for film fans. The first redesign from the fridge to the tank-like chamber was primarily due to Spielberg and company worrying about little kids crawling into them and getting trapped because they saw Marty do it. The change from the chamber to the DeLorean was because of the director came to realize that if you were traveling through time, you'd want something that could be mobile so you can be able to hide it and get the heck out of dodge.

Another example is the character of Zhaan from the TV series Farscape. Originally, Zhaan was designed to be a heavyset male who was name Zen. They ended up changing the character to what we ended up with. Ironically, Ben Browder must have known about the original concept, as he included the original character design in the episode he written called "John Quixote."

A better explanation/example is the following video: Star Wars Episode I: Thousands Of Things Webisode - YouTube

It's the production designer's job to look at these options, see which ones work, then bump it up to the director to see if he thinks it will work. That's why there's things that are concepts. Until the director or the head honcho places his seal of approval on it, the concept provided is only an option. And, as someone pointed out earlier, sometime, certain bits and pieces the head honcho may like that the designer can apply to another concept design.

The same is true for models.

mslz22

MMMM gondolas in meat sauce....


I will say that my take on the concept stuff, for me anyway, is a natural extension of my fascination with the behind the scenes stuff. I don't have any builds in progress, or even any of the kits right now, because like J i have more ideas and projects than i have time at the moment.......

Boba Flint

I've always liked the concept models. I likr how they show the thinking process of how the designers were trying to bring some of Lucas' ideas to life. I would like to buld some of them and display them next to the final design. To show the evolution of the ship so-to-speak.

asemblyrequired

Well , the " hero" ships have been juiced for all their worth over the years . Between posters , toys and T-shirts you see some of the ships endlessly. I enjoy seeing new concepts and designs. I always think it's great to see someone wade into the deep water of creativity and try concepts. I personally like the progression concepts of the AT-AT / scout walkers more than the finals in some cases.



-James

ralphee

Yeah forgot about the ATST concept art, some of them are just awesome, and would make superb models in there own right.....one even has a very Mak feel to it?
The art of ESB does have some wonderful stages of concepts, some of which, if they made it to screen, would have had just as many fans.

lee

Nwerke

Johnston and McQuarrie sketches I'm quite keen on, for the most part. I pretty much hate the Cantwell models.

dbhs

As someone who recently finished a build of a concept design I thought I'd chime in. I think a lot of the concept designs are great and there's several more I'd like to build someday. Just because a concept design wasn't chosen for a 'role' in a movie doesn't make it a bad design.

There's a lot of the sketches that are just part of the design brain-storming process and express an idea without yet being fully flushed out. Design can be a very time consuming process and if you were to take each and every idea to final completion you'd never make your deadline.

Some designs just aren't appropriate for the style or look of the world they are being designed for. The concept Raider I did is a good example of that. I think it is a great design but would have been a terrible choice for a Cylon raider. It just doesn't have that feel to it.

Ray22

Alot of the concept sketches from the Star Wars sketchbook by Joe Johnston had some really cool designs and were not far off from the final designs, I did a couple of models based on his designs.

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3d-builder

Star Wars to me is Just an expression.......an avenue to build stuff,
if I wasn't into Star Wars I would be building something anyway. I
don't think I would ever run out of things to build in regards to Star Wars
models.....props........... especially scratch-building because it just takes so
much time. I look at all the subject matter in the Chronicles book and I say.....
"Not in my life time will I get every thing I want!" LOL

I think when you have spent enough time and can pretty much
build whatever you want, the possibilities become a little endless,
so you can never be done! lol

I like a lot of the concepts and not so interested in others,
that's just the way it goes.......took me until now to start
liking some of episode 1 stuff! LOL

qcfoundry

totally second that. cantwell, imo, had the tastes of a 8 year old (forget where i read it - but he had a fascination with silver paint and pill bottles). also really like Johnston sketches.

Guy Cowen

Michael, I think you may have a fever , have a relaxed day mate and take it easy. TPM is a last resort at best only joking. I actually really like a lot of the concept stuff for TPM a lot more than the final design's, this pretty much across the 3 PT films for me.

Of all the ships in those movies the Jedi starfighter from Ep3 is my fav and would love to tackle it one day, Lasse's build of this was incredible and such a shame we never saw it painted.

JMChladek

I think part of the desire to do concept models is for the modeler in question replicating the subject to get away from the known and do the less known for a bit. I mean how many variations of an X-wing can be done? Okay, a lot still. Lets refine that and say how many variations of Luke's Red 5 X-Wing can be done? TIE Fighters if done to studio model standards typically are going to look about the same (almost clean, uniform gray shade with black panels) and many Y-wings will look similar to one another as well (how many Red Jammers have been done?).

With a concept, the rules aren't necessarily as set in stone and things have to be figured out. Translating a two dimensional sketch to 3D can reveal some problems that have to be overcome and problem solving is a skill that many good modelers love to exercise at various levels. They can throw some of their own creativity and interpretation into the subject as opposed to being pinned down to certain images and believing they have to replicate those details exactly.